It would have been nice if he at least spelled my name correctly. Indeed, a lowercase v. No Shift there. Couldn’t resist. I wonder why he reads this weblog if he dislikes nitpickers that much. Perhaps he only referred to the first definition of utterance, which isn’t that bad. Comments are open, for once.
Comments are open, for once.
Really? Are you sure?
Anyway, regarding the "van" issue, I get that too all the time. Really irritating. I think this is because non-Dutch people don't understand what it means. It simply means "from" and is traditionally followed by the name of the area the person (or their ancestors) literally come from. Although it's part of the surname, it should never be capitalised.
I know, silly thing, but hey. We're Dutchmen. :)
Nitpicking about nitpicking...mmmm.
He does come across as a Fckr though (there goes my reputation too!) his previous post is fun though and I can't wait for mierenneuker* to take over the web!
*Yes is not written miereneuker, but mierenneuker. It is, however, pronounced as miereneuker. (me-Rrr-eh-neu-Kerrr)
In other news, web-graphics.com has followed Anne's lead, and makes commenters write html. Are no line-breaks on the house anymore the new black?
Yeah, you don't want to know how much my name (Jeroen van der Meer) has been misspelled. And lets not talk about the amount of time it has been mispronounced. But usually I don't really care. I just tell them to call me Jero which solves the problem.
Notice that I don’t have comments here, thereby denying these aggrieved people the right to reply.
Right to reply…? What is he on about?
Mind you, if there's one thing worse than a capitalizesd "Van" when it shouldn't be, it's a non-capitalized one when it should be.
In the Netherlands, as a general rule, it's mostly "van". In Belgium it depends. You could have "Van der Meersch" or "Vander Meersch" or "Van Der Meersch" or "Vandermeersch" or even "Van Dermeersch" or "Van dermeersch". A lowercase v is mostly reserved for nobility.
And of course, to make things really interesting: all of the Belgian names above would be under V in an alphabetical list, while "van Kesteren" in the Netherlands would be under K.
I'm sure there's a lesson in there somewhere. Something to do with standards and HTML and stuff. :)
Since we're on that most important subject, does the Dutch "van" imply a degree of nobility like the French "de"? (which literally means the same thing)
It could be, Kesteren is a placename I think and the "van" usually implies some kind of placename or area that the nobility governed. But the Dutch "de" as in my name can also imply nobility of some sorts I think. Either way, if it ever meant something it stopped doing so hundreds of years ago. The French "de" in my mothers name does mean something though I think. Bluh, who cares.
You could have "Van der Meersch" or "Vander Meersch" or "Van Der Meersch" or "Vandermeersch" or even "Van Dermeersch" or "Van dermeersch".
And of course, to make things really interesting: all of the Belgian names above would be under V in an alphabetical list, while "van Kesteren" in the Netherlands would be under K.
I'm sure there's a lesson in there somewhere. Something to do with standards and HTML and stuff. :)
I guess you could make the lesson about Unicode collation. I have actually used a surname with “van der” as test data, but I ended up sorting it according to v, because the Finnish market was the main concern. Second lesson about data entry and Web forms: If you have a person with a multipart unhyphenated eg. Spanish given name and a multipart unhyphenated eg. Dutch surname, you cannot reliably use one field for name and split the given name and surname on space. (One of my fictitious test personas is called Jesus Maria van der Beken.)
In names, 'van' means 'of'.
Ruud of Nistelrooy, Robin of Persie, Duchess of York, Anne of Kesteren. Just like 'of' in Duchess of York, you don't write 'van' with a capital letter. Easy.
It doesn't need to be a placename per se, as lot's of people made up names when Napoleon forced everyone to have a surname.
Yes is not written miereneuker, but mierenneuker
That's only true since the last Useless Spelling Reform, which I choose to ignore (because it is bloody useless). I go with the rules I learnt in school (yes, I'm that old): if it's not necessarily plural, don't use the extra -n-, so: miereneuker (because someone could be a monogamous antfucker).
Comments are open, for once.
Yeah, what's up with that anyway, man? WTF, closed comments? If you don't want discussion, then just don't blog it! If it's one-way communication, I'm not interested.
Heh, you shouldn’t worry about it too much. It seems like this person has a problem with capitalization in general. (“Word Of The Day” should be “Word of the Day”.)
Wait, excuse me. That would be nitpicking. :P
("Word Of The Day" should be "Word of the Day".)
Maybe. I've always felt like capitalising all the words - since they are all words. And if you ran the text through a parser to capitalise it, every word would be affected. So where does that leave old-school grammar that says not to capitalise words like "of" and "the"? I'd say it depends on the individual.
There's a perfect word describing Jeremy boy: douchebag.
Interesting about the Belgian names; in Afrikaans the "van" is almost always loose and with a small "v".
Anyway, I feel sorry for the poor bugger coming to my blog if he/she doesn't like nitpicking. I even nitpick the nitpickers. :D
you're such an antfucker.
WTF, closed comments? If you don't want discussion, then just don't blog it! If it's one-way communication, I'm not interested.
So nobody actually reads Kottke, right?
He's got a strong case though. We fuck too many ants.
and what's in a name?
Ron Bogart, er, ron vanderBoogaard? er, Ron Bogengaart, Ron?
"Hey You" will do, as long as you speak with two words.
We found a solution: Our name is Zondervan.
That means: »without van«. Maybe some ancestor got annoyed with repeated capitalization, maybe it was just another miereneuker.
WTF, closed comments? If you don't want discussion, then just don't blog it! If it's one-way communication, I'm not interested.
So nobody actually reads Kottke, right?
Does anyone read Kottke?
Here in Scotland we kinda have a similar issue with pronunciations of "Macs". There a three anglicised spellings: Mac, Mc and M' (M appostrophe, tho you don't see this much anymore). They're all pronounced Mac. However, some people insist on saying Mc as Mick. As a Mc myself this really makes my blood boil, particularly since I have to spell my Gaelic surname phonetically so that non-Gaelic lingophones can even say it in the first place.
So Paul McCartney should be pronounced Paul Mac-Cartney and not Paul Mucartney?